Carefree Truth
Issue #712, December 18, 2018
With the discussions finished, Mayor Les Peterson called for a vote. Councilwoman Cheryl Kroyer asked for a clarification of what was being voted on, since a lot had been discussed in over 2 hours.
Vice Mayor John Crane said looking at that corner and all that's going on around it, he believes it is a commercial corner. The questions deal with proximity to the neighbors and density. He commended Provence HOA president Mike Johnson and the developer for working together. Mike Johnson provided great leadership for his HOA on a very difficult topic. He has done a great service by resolving almost every issue. Mayor Peterson seconded that praise.
Vice Mayor Crane suggested the car wash be removed as a Special Use Permit (SUP) candidate and prohibited on the property. He suggested the same prohibition for a 24 hour ambulatory emergency medical center. He noted that if someone is trying to sell their home, they have two choices. They can disclose the potential medical center or they can chose not to disclose it, leaving the buyer to not only understand the zoning, but also what is subject to a SUP. "That's asking a lot." If a seller makes the disclosure, it makes it difficult to sell the home. The Vice Mayor wanted it off the table, not allowed at all. Ms. Kroyer agreed, saying she didn't think the residents in Provence would ever agree to approve a SUP on either item, so no use leaving them hanging out there.
Vice Mayor Crane noted Mike Johnson asked that the part saying the architecture would use residential type colors "and/or" materials be changed to "and". The Vice Mayor agreed with that. He also asked if the finished floor differential could be stipulated as being 7'-11'. The developer had suggested that there could be a 2' differential from 9' in the grade. Brennan Ray, the developer's attorney, said yes, subject to the final engineering details. They are trying to compromise. Ms. Kroyer asked where the compromise was, when it was supposed to be 9'. Mr. Ray replied that it was to allow for that variance in the grade when they don't know the final engineering details. Their goal is to keep it as low as possible, but they won't be able to start the final engineering study that will provide those answers until the rezoning is approved.
Mike Johnson liked Scott Sperl's suggestion of lowering the building heights according to the grade, saying it gave them in incentive to make it work. Councilman Stephen Hatcher said if the variance is off by 6" and the building height is modified by 6", what's the difference? 6" on a 30' tall building is nothing. Mr. Ray said that sounds good in simplistic terms, but he didn't know if 6" would make a difference in terms of where clear space is needed.
Planning Director Stacey Bridge-Denzak attempted to clarify the finished floor grade issue. The first Stipulation, addressing "substantial compliance", is very important. The applicant fulfilled the requirement to provide a conceptual grading and drainage plan. There will not suddenly be a building that is 5' taller than what has been designed. This is what they plan to build. Buyers and tenants want to understand what this will look like as well. A 2' variable is considered very reasonable. Step 2 will refine the grading and drainage plan, but refinements don't mean adding substantial changes. Project designs are not done at the rezoning stage. The information provided is a framework. Mr. Ray agreed that the developer is subject to Stipulation #1. Mrs. Bridge-Denzak stressed that if the project is not in substantial compliance, it cannot move ahead.
Some members of the audience became quite loud and aggressive, saying, "We live here and you don't!" Some insisted that the item be tabled until more information was available. Mrs. Bridge-Denzak replied that applications are based on all the professional information provided to the Town, and then they look to the Council to make the decision. She felt it was very inappropriate for audience members to question her professional integrity.
Vice Mayor Crane said his next comment had to do with the westernmost entry, which he understood to be a full movement access point. He believed that it should be right in/right out, subject to reconsideration after Carefree Highway is widened to 4 lanes. He understood the discussion with the developer earlier in the meeting, but feels that with 2 lanes and all the traffic, it's a safety issue. Mr. Ray replied that he preferred the driveway be looked at and the access determined by an updated traffic study, so professionals can determine if it is appropriate and safe as a full movement access point or if it should be restricted to right in/right out. Councilman Vince D'Aliesio noted that a new traffic study should be done during the peak season and when the school kids are being dropped off and picked up.
Mayor Peterson recapped the discussed items. The car wash and the emergency care center would not be permitted under any circumstances. The 8' wall (6' of masonry on 2' of berm) would go as far south as possible. The design would substantially comply with the 9' finished floor differential. All lights would be shielded and in compliance with Town Code. Mr. Ray agreed to supply an updated traffic report, with particular attention paid to the westernmost access point on Carefree Highway. The use of residential architectural colors and materials would be changed from "and/or" to "and". There would be no restrictions placed on 5 drive-thru pad uses, but they would be restricted to locations along arterial roads and could not be located north of the wash.
The motion to approve the rezoning with the amended stipulations was unanimously approved.
https://vimeo.com/302625376
Lyn Hitchon
Prepared by Carefree Truth
Visit our website at www.carefreetruth2.com If you know anyone who would like to be added to the Carefree Truth email list, please have them contact me. Feel free to share Carefree Truth with others on your list.
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Issue #712, December 18, 2018
With the discussions finished, Mayor Les Peterson called for a vote. Councilwoman Cheryl Kroyer asked for a clarification of what was being voted on, since a lot had been discussed in over 2 hours.
Vice Mayor John Crane said looking at that corner and all that's going on around it, he believes it is a commercial corner. The questions deal with proximity to the neighbors and density. He commended Provence HOA president Mike Johnson and the developer for working together. Mike Johnson provided great leadership for his HOA on a very difficult topic. He has done a great service by resolving almost every issue. Mayor Peterson seconded that praise.
Vice Mayor Crane suggested the car wash be removed as a Special Use Permit (SUP) candidate and prohibited on the property. He suggested the same prohibition for a 24 hour ambulatory emergency medical center. He noted that if someone is trying to sell their home, they have two choices. They can disclose the potential medical center or they can chose not to disclose it, leaving the buyer to not only understand the zoning, but also what is subject to a SUP. "That's asking a lot." If a seller makes the disclosure, it makes it difficult to sell the home. The Vice Mayor wanted it off the table, not allowed at all. Ms. Kroyer agreed, saying she didn't think the residents in Provence would ever agree to approve a SUP on either item, so no use leaving them hanging out there.
Vice Mayor Crane noted Mike Johnson asked that the part saying the architecture would use residential type colors "and/or" materials be changed to "and". The Vice Mayor agreed with that. He also asked if the finished floor differential could be stipulated as being 7'-11'. The developer had suggested that there could be a 2' differential from 9' in the grade. Brennan Ray, the developer's attorney, said yes, subject to the final engineering details. They are trying to compromise. Ms. Kroyer asked where the compromise was, when it was supposed to be 9'. Mr. Ray replied that it was to allow for that variance in the grade when they don't know the final engineering details. Their goal is to keep it as low as possible, but they won't be able to start the final engineering study that will provide those answers until the rezoning is approved.
Mike Johnson liked Scott Sperl's suggestion of lowering the building heights according to the grade, saying it gave them in incentive to make it work. Councilman Stephen Hatcher said if the variance is off by 6" and the building height is modified by 6", what's the difference? 6" on a 30' tall building is nothing. Mr. Ray said that sounds good in simplistic terms, but he didn't know if 6" would make a difference in terms of where clear space is needed.
Planning Director Stacey Bridge-Denzak attempted to clarify the finished floor grade issue. The first Stipulation, addressing "substantial compliance", is very important. The applicant fulfilled the requirement to provide a conceptual grading and drainage plan. There will not suddenly be a building that is 5' taller than what has been designed. This is what they plan to build. Buyers and tenants want to understand what this will look like as well. A 2' variable is considered very reasonable. Step 2 will refine the grading and drainage plan, but refinements don't mean adding substantial changes. Project designs are not done at the rezoning stage. The information provided is a framework. Mr. Ray agreed that the developer is subject to Stipulation #1. Mrs. Bridge-Denzak stressed that if the project is not in substantial compliance, it cannot move ahead.
Some members of the audience became quite loud and aggressive, saying, "We live here and you don't!" Some insisted that the item be tabled until more information was available. Mrs. Bridge-Denzak replied that applications are based on all the professional information provided to the Town, and then they look to the Council to make the decision. She felt it was very inappropriate for audience members to question her professional integrity.
Vice Mayor Crane said his next comment had to do with the westernmost entry, which he understood to be a full movement access point. He believed that it should be right in/right out, subject to reconsideration after Carefree Highway is widened to 4 lanes. He understood the discussion with the developer earlier in the meeting, but feels that with 2 lanes and all the traffic, it's a safety issue. Mr. Ray replied that he preferred the driveway be looked at and the access determined by an updated traffic study, so professionals can determine if it is appropriate and safe as a full movement access point or if it should be restricted to right in/right out. Councilman Vince D'Aliesio noted that a new traffic study should be done during the peak season and when the school kids are being dropped off and picked up.
Mayor Peterson recapped the discussed items. The car wash and the emergency care center would not be permitted under any circumstances. The 8' wall (6' of masonry on 2' of berm) would go as far south as possible. The design would substantially comply with the 9' finished floor differential. All lights would be shielded and in compliance with Town Code. Mr. Ray agreed to supply an updated traffic report, with particular attention paid to the westernmost access point on Carefree Highway. The use of residential architectural colors and materials would be changed from "and/or" to "and". There would be no restrictions placed on 5 drive-thru pad uses, but they would be restricted to locations along arterial roads and could not be located north of the wash.
The motion to approve the rezoning with the amended stipulations was unanimously approved.
https://vimeo.com/302625376
Lyn Hitchon
Prepared by Carefree Truth
Visit our website at www.carefreetruth2.com If you know anyone who would like to be added to the Carefree Truth email list, please have them contact me. Feel free to share Carefree Truth with others on your list.
Visit www.carefreeazbusinesses.com to see more info about businesses in Carefree. Please support our merchants.